Gerry Duggan previews the third act of his cosmic odyssey!
Written by Jess Harrold
The Infinity Stones have returned to the Marvel Universe, and the race is already on to find them. But when INFINITY COUNTDOWN ends, INFINITY WARS begins! Here, writer Gerry Duggan and editor Jordan D. White discuss the cosmic event to end all cosmic events!
Marvel: Gerry, you followed up ALL-NEW GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY with INFINITY COUNTDOWN, and now it’s time to ask you the big question: what are you counting down to?
Gerry Duggan: Guardians was the first act—and as big as Countdown is, it was the second act. INFINITY WARS contains the last act of my cosmic story.
Marvel: What can you tell us about the state of Marvel’s cosmos when Countdown ends?
Jordan D. White: Well, I don’t want to spoil the ending of Countdown, but suffice it to say possession of a couple of the Infinity Stones has yet to be completely settled until Countdown comes to a close. When it does, the stage will be set at last for the requiem of the Infinity Stones to begin, driving us toward Infinity’s end! We are going to learn a lot about the Infinity Stones, how they work and why. And we’re going to see some…interesting combinations of characters, let’s say. Ones no one is expecting, that is for sure.
Marvel: Can we expect to see the Guardians of the Galaxy front and center?
Gerry Duggan: Yes and no. They’ll play a part, but the Stones are scattered and in a lot of different hands. Some of those hands are very happy to be holding the one rock they have. Others will want to assemble the entire set. Yes, it will be a big story, but it’s also going to be a lot of fun. The first act of INFINITY WARS is like “The Warriors“—if each gang had a magic rock. Most of the Marvel “families” will be represented in one way or another. This story began in space, continues on Earth…and ends up somewhere new.
Marvel: Anything Infinity-related tends to involve a certain Mad Titan, who is making major waves in other media this year. What is Thanos up to during your story?
Gerry Duggan: He’s one of my favorite parts of this tale. I think his appearance in the PRIME issue will set a new tone for him and drive home that this is, in fact, a very different Thanos story, with some unexpected dividends in the back end.
Marvel: Obviously, “Infinity” is a word with quite some pedigree in the Marvel Universe. Were you a fan of Jim Starlin’s original INFINITY GAUNTLET/WAR/CRUSADE trilogy—and indeed Starlin’s cosmic storytelling in general?
Gerry Duggan: I love Starlin’s work. His collaborations were always so big and bold. That said, this is a different story. I don’t want to be anyone’s cover band. I know readers love Jim’s work as much as I do. I’m borrowing the toys to tell a different tale.
Marvel: Gerry certainly has taken Marvel’s cosmos in a very different direction—and one unique to him. Since he’s describing this book as his “final act,” it seems like a good opportunity to ask you, Jordan, what have you enjoyed about his stewardship of the Guardians of the Galaxy and the rest of the Marvel cosmos?
Jordan D. White: Working with Gerry is terrific—he and I share so much when it comes to sensibilities. We both come at even the most dramatic story from the structure of comedy, in an odd way. Which is not to say the story is a gag—far from it. The “punchline” in Gerry’s cosmic tales is more punch than line, and it’s going to knock people off their feet.
Marvel: Speaking of knocking folks off their feet, you have an art team capable of doing just that on INFINITY WARS, right?
Gerry Duggan: It will be worth it for Mike Deodato Jr. and Frank Martin’s work alone. They are so great. This is the best work I’ve seen from them, and best of all we’ve been at this long enough that they will be providing art for the entire run. I went to New York for a one-day meeting about this story at the end of last year, and we had a blast cooking up some of our biggest ideas. I’m really happy with what we’re going to get away with.
Marvel: So if your story was this year’s big movie, what would the trailer guy say about it?
Gerry Duggan: Not a damn thing. I’d kill him first.
The battle begins with INFINITY WARS: PRIME #1, on sale July 25!
The Russo Brothers Give Us An Insider Look on How They Tackled 'Avengers: Infinity War'
Published Mar 15, 2018
By Christine Dinh
Get a glimpse on the storytelling elements from balancing tones to collaborations and more.
How do you approach the behemoth that is Marvel Studios’ “Avengers: Infinity War” — a film with ten years of baggage with different storylines, different visions, different tones, to honor? How does a storyteller divide screen time among 40+ major players who are at different stages of their journeys and continue to engage and surprise viewers? The challenge and weight of what this film means to many is not lost on “Avengers: Infinity War” directors Anthony Russo and Joe Russo.
The Russos entered the Marvel Cinematic Universe as storytellers with “Captain America: The Winter Soldier” joined by screenwriters Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely. The team went on to tackle higher stakes with “Captain America: Civil War.” Not to be outdone, they’re now tackling 20-some heroes, multiple locations, six Infinity Stones, and the baddest/most powerful villain our heroes have ever encountered—Thanos, with the next “Avengers” installment. The Brothers shared insight on their approach to the characters, the complications of putting together a project of this scale, and dropped some insights during our intimate set visit.
[Note: This interview has been edited for clarity.]
How “Avengers: Infinity War” Kicks Off
“Avengers: Infinity War” is two years following “Captain America: Civil War.” According to Anthony, “Infinity War” is a “direct corollary to the end of ‘Civil War,’ and our heroes will be heading into this film “with the ramifications of that film at the forefront of this film.”
Continuing, “[‘Infinity War’] is very much about how we move forward from ‘Civil War’ in a big way, and what happens to that division between the Avengers and how does that affect them. What does that mean when the greatest threat they’ll ever face comes to them.”
Despite the two years following “Civil War,” the Russo Brothers have a storytelling philosophy where make sure to “keep any big moments of the characters’ lives on camera.”
We know Cap’s team of Avengers find their way to Wakanda seeking aid from King T’Challa. Joe explained the fortified country is the most “logical place for anyone seeking refuge.”
Meanwhile, Tony Stark has to deal with the consequences of his choice to side with the Sokovia Accords. Our directors haven’t forgotten young Peter Parker. “They basically have a unique mentor/mentee relationship that continues to evolve as they move into this film,” shared Anthony.
With the Guardians, the directors acknowledged the film picks up 5-6 years following “Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2.” The Guardians have had a chance to deepen their relationships with each other where the Avengers haven’t had that chance.
“They’re closer, and they’re tighter, and they’ve been doing it for a while,” said Anthony. “They’ve cemented their chemistry as a team. And they would stand in contrast with the other teams. Potentially.”
They’re thrilled at the chance to take on Thor and lean into his profound experience during “Thor: Ragnarok.” As for Hawkeye, the Russos confirmed he’s on his own journey in this film.
The Directors’ Approach to the Tone and Characters, and their Collaboration with Past Filmmakers
“It’s been a personal journey for us as filmmakers from ‘Winter Soldier,’ of a theme set in that movie that we then tried to expand upon in ‘Civil War,’ that then led to Infinity War,” shared Joe Russo. “It’s how we feel about the characters, as comic book fans, the story that we want to see.”
“It’s not only a culmination of the last ten years of Marvel storytelling, but for us, it’s a culmination of our journey as directors to the Marvel Universe,” added Joe. “Having at our disposal all of those characters and allowing ourselves to re-filter them through the way that we see the universe, the way that we feel about the characters, the themes that we really want to bring to the forefront, that’s what these two movies are for us.”
“Everything’s always got to be character based,” proclaimed Anthony. “If we’re sitting in the editing room, watch the sequences for more than 20 seconds without a character having a point of view or moving the action forward, my brain just shuts down. The action for us, it’s always character based.”
In addition to screenwriters Markus and McFeely, the Russos credited the team there were able to work with the past films, including effects supervisor Dan Deleeuw, editor Jeff Ford, DP Trent Opaloch, and stunt coordinator Sam Hargrave, to achieving the complex and ambitious nature of “Infinity War.”
It was important for the Russos to honor the journeys and approach the other MCU filmmakers took their characters on, but also make it work with the film they were creating. As Joe explained, the “Russo Brothers-execution” was filtering what others have done “through our very personal expression of them as characters.” Anthony acknowledged, “Everyone is interwoven in this plot in a way where they have an emotional connection to the story…. You can’t tell a movie with this many characters and not have each of those characters show up and honor them from the different franchises if they are not motivated to be there. If there are not in life or death circumstances. If they are not fighting to save their belief system or way of life.”
The Russos equated the MCU process as similar to how comic book stories evolve and involve several comic creators. “[We] found repeatedly that the best and only way for us to move forward is to receive that information, and keep what we like, and explore what we like, and exploit what we like, and tell the story that we want to tell. The same way you do in a comic run when you’re reading it, you go, ‘I want to see someone else’s point-of-view on that.’ That’s what Marvel’s done really well, bringing in a lot of different voices to execute the films.”
It’s safe to say everyone in the Marvel Universe had been involved. During the preparation and production of the third and fourth “Avengers” films, the Russos had the opportunity to collaborate closely with James Gunn, Taika Waititi, Scott Derrickson, Peyton Reed, Ryan Coogler, and producer Nate Moore. With the Marvel Universe progressing in different courses simultaneously and at the time, not yet completed, the Russos adopted a “real collaborative united artists approach” to ensure they were sensitive to the other stories and sharing those elements.
The Sources and Influences
Mark Ruffalo previously alluded to how THE INFINITY GAUNTLET informed the film, but there are clear deviations. Joe further elaborated on the comics source: “Certainly the Starlin book was our jumping off point. It’s a brilliant comic, and the ideas behind it are so large, it’s what pushed us to go for the scale that we’re going for on these movies.”
Joe continuing, “Anth and I love the post-modern comics. We’re also drawing from newer INFINITY stuff, and we’re kind of combining it all into…how do we see elements from each helping the story that we want to tell.”
In addition, the Russos were inspired by ensemble 90s crime films, and the two films that they look to for inspiration in relation to narrative imagery were “Two Days in the Valley” and “Out of Sight.”
“These movies are so complex you need a unifying peace, or a sense of cohesion, and that cohesion can come from a narrative construct that you can apply all the characters to,” explained Joe Russo.
Thanos (Josh Brolin)
True Believers, you’ve never seen a more formidable antagonist in the MCU like the Mad Titan, and he’s on a destructive mission to collect all the Infinity Stones no matter the stakes.
“This movie is catalyzed by Thanos’ decision and an opportunity for him to make a very aggressive move for the stones, a more effective move for the stones than he has ever in the past,” revealed Anthony. “When Thanos decides to do it, he really goes for it. He’s one step ahead of our heroes through the movie and he puts them through a lot of pain in the process.”
“Our job with Thanos is to make him the preeminent villain in the Marvel Universe,” added Joe. “In order to be a preeminent villain, you have to do some pretty bad things.”
The Russos stressed that the Infinity Stones are the “bedrock of the film” — “the key driver.”
Prepare Your Hearts
On the subject of Thanos, several of our heroes wield/guard the Infinity Stones putting them in directly in the path of Thanos, elevating the emotional weight. When asked about the invincibility of our heroes, Joe quickly teased, “I’m sorry.”
Acknowledging that every character is someone’s favorite character, Anthony explained, “We like mature storytelling. We like dramatic storytelling. We like intense storytelling. We appreciate conflict, and we appreciate stakes. And without stakes, there really isn’t a lot of value to the story. If you look at the Marvel Universe as a whole, as a story that’s been told for 10 years, you can look at [‘Infinity War’] as the climax. The stakes will be higher in this movie than they’ve ever been, times ten.”
Once the dust settles, we can expect the Avengers to see major casualties as they protect the universe and all of existence from Thanos.
Topping the “Civil War” Airport Fight Scene
“We have an equivalent that’s like if you had a comic book, and you open it up to your double panel, and then you fold it out. And then you fold it out again and again,” said Joe Russo.
Anthony Russo adding, “And you have another comic book laid out next to it.” “So we have the equivalent of that in this movie,” continued Joe Russo.
Hinting at the Untitled Fourth “Avengers” Film
The Brothers on the new challenge of shooting two MCU films at the same time: “Our approach has always been how we look at the project. It’s simply the same thing in the way that the ‘Winter Soldier’ related to ‘Civil War,’ and the way that ‘Civil War’ relates to ‘Infinity War.’ These two movies will also relate…but at the same time, there’s an independence in terms of what the experience is or where the story goes. It isn’t a true two-parter…. It ended up being more of two singular expressions.”
“We always try to make each film different so they don’t get repetitive,” said Joe. “This kind of serialized storytelling…. You have to keep evolving who’s at the forefront, how you’re laying the story out because rigor mortis will set in very quickly. Each character…can shape and color and re-tone an entire film depending on who you’re following. We find them as exciting as complex and inspiring and heartbreaking, and we believe that there are real emotional stakes. This is exactly the kind of movies we aspire to and exactly the kind of movies we look for as film goers in a theater.”
It’s safe to say that we’ve never seen anything like “Avengers: Infinity War.” Closing out the visit, Joe remarked, “If you were to think of the Marvel Universe over the last ten years of the book, this is the ending of the book. There may be new books written, but this is certainly the ending of this book.”
“Avengers: Infinity War” opens in theaters on April 27. Stay tuned to Marvel.com, follow @Avengers on Twitter, and Like “The Avengers” on Facebook for the latest on the Avengers as it develops!